Beyond Sunday S2: Joy in the Now and Not Yet
Catch up: this week’s Sunday morning message.
God’s people are called to a unique type of joy. It’s more than a happy mood. It's a choice to trust that God will fulfill his promises, and it's a joy that is long-lasting and life-giving. Every verse of the hymn ends with a command to rejoice—even in exile, even in waiting. This is the paradox of Advent joy: we rejoice not because everything is right, but because the One who will make it right is both on His way and here now. This joy is deeper than happiness—it’s the defiant joy of faith that knows the story isn’t over. We can rejoice, not because all is fulfilled yet, but because fulfillment is coming. This dynamic tension of the now and not yet is the essence of Advent… and the reality of being a Jesus-shaped church. Will we embrace the joy being offered this Christmas season?
Catch up: this week’s Sunday morning message.
-
00:00:09 - 00:01:19 Introduction to Beyond Sunday podcast and Advent season
00:01:36 - 00:02:39 Theme of joy in third week of Advent
00:02:07 - 00:04:00 Scripture references: Luke, Isaiah, Peter, Thessalonians
00:03:24 - 00:06:51 Isaiah 35 and Jesus' fulfillment of prophecy
00:06:18 - 00:10:46 Joy amid brokenness and real-life struggles
00:10:12 - 00:13:36 Joy as strength during weariness and doubt
00:12:59 - 00:20:22 Inexpressible joy empowering difficult seasons
00:19:52 - 00:30:02 Choosing closeness to Jesus to cultivate joy and peace
-
00:00:09
Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of the Beyond Sunday podcast where we desire to take the conversation beyond Sunday and go deeper. I'm joined here with Pastor Sherea. How are you doing today? >> I'm good. How are you? >> I'm great. Great. Excited for this one. This is uh third week into the Advent season. So, uh, before we get into the conversation, take a look [music] at this video. [music] [music] Heat. Heat. [music] >> [music] [music] [music] >> All right, welcome back as we dive into
00:01:36
the conversation. This is again the third week of Advent. Uh it's the theme of joy. Uh and that is no different for us. We are following the themes that are existent in the advent. So hope, peace, this week uh or this last week was joy. Uh but Sheree, what was the big idea in some of the scriptures we were in? >> Uh yeah. Well, we've been again every week uh through the context of the now and the not yet. So uh like the last weeks, this this time the emphasis was joy in the now and the not yet. Um
00:02:07
scripture-wise, this week I have so much scripture. I'm actually like I don't know which of these were from the the uh RCL and which weren't necessarily um cuz we went a lot of different places but we were in Luke 1. I know that was uh part of that was from the RCL. Um Isaiah 35 uh was kind of a a >> um big one for us. Um and then I we were also in First Peter. Um we were in First Thessalonians. So yeah, kind of all over some Psalms. Where were you? >> I I was in two. I mean, typically when
00:02:44
we uh when you and I are preaching, here's what will happen. I will I'll I'll focus in on a one or two or or maybe three that are like really standing out to me and speaking to me and to the what what I sense God is is sharing with me and wanting to to share with our our church family. And uh you will have like the the entirety many times in your notes you're like and the entirety of scripture. Um >> I never put that. all 66 books. Um, >> I supposed to choose [laughter] like
00:03:24
good stuff in there. >> Oh, yeah. You're like, there's so much good. Let me read it all for you. Um, but I Isaiah 35, yes, was a big one for me. And then also Matthew 11 because I saw the tiein to what Jesus was telling John the Baptist's followers, disciples to Isaiah 35. It seemed like, "Oh, here tell John." Because John was in prison, uh, and and was asking his disciples like, "Go ask Jesus, are you the one we've been waiting for?" And then Jesus's
00:03:55
response to uh John's disciples uh really drew me back to Isaiah 35 of this um what will be restored what it will look like in in in when when God restores because when Isaiah is writing this to those they're in exile it doesn't look like this. This is it also is calling out calling attention to spaces in like uh like the desert being um uh like there being being growth or blossoming um in the desert and you know streams in a wasteland like these kind of things like yeah when when that takes place I'm
00:04:40
going to take notice because it typically in reality those don't look like that right barren things don't look lush. Uh and yet and yet that's what Isaiah is calling attention to. And then Jesus is like, "Hey, the the the blind are seeing, the lame are walking, lepers are being healed, and all all these other things are taking place." It calls me back to the here what you've read about in the what the prophets wrote, here we're seeing it take place through Jesus. >> Yeah.
00:05:16
Well, and at the front end of that Isaiah passage, and this is what was sticking for me. So, in the same way, yeah. Um, we've been in Isaiah every week, uh, of this advent series because if you're talking about the not yet, >> um, Isaiah paints many pictures of, uh, what will be to offer hope, to offer peace, to offer joy. >> But that was the thing at the front end of this passage. Um he he talks about these things, joy and and the the knowledge of what will be, the promises
00:05:45
of what will be and the joy that comes out of that. Um that that can strengthen tired hands and encourage those who have weak knees. And that piece like um for me was there uh in much of this series there's echoes um of last year's advent series which I guess makes sense in the advent season. But last year we talked a lot about um like plastic emotions. And so this idea of showing up uh anytime, but especially at Christmas time with this like everything's good. I've got to have joy and hope and love and peace.
00:06:18
But recognizing like we live in the now, not in the not yet. And so in the now there's brokenness and and all of those things. And so um in that space like >> recognizing as I as I stood there Sunday morning, it's like I'm we're going to talk about joy, but I also know the stories of the people sitting in front of me and I also know the stories of of our community and the world around us. I mean, right now we're we're like flooding and um there's a lot of people
00:06:44
who uh maybe are not like, "Yeah, joy is so great right now." Um and so in some ways this promise of Isaiah of like use these things of what of what will be reminders of uh what will be because it's actually a reminder of who God is uh who God is right now that can be a strength to weary hands, weak knees, um that that kind of idea. And so um yeah, I liked that passage for that. >> Yeah. Well, even at the tail end of it, you talk about the beginning of it of of these places that there'll be
00:07:21
restoration that will come in places that um will take notice just because of of the devastation or the brokenness that existed before. But then the tail end of this is um and a highway will be there and it will be called the way of holiness. Um and it will be for those who walk the way. uh then he like talking about at the very end of verse 10 then or they will enter Zion with singing everlasting joy will crown their heads gladness and joy will overtake them and sorrow and sighing will flee away this this call to here's what will
00:07:56
come here's what will be uh and um and the promise of God that then you know then when I was getting to Matthew 11 and and John's got these questions like, well, is is it is he the one? Right? Is uh are you the one who who was to come or should we expect someone else? And as I was reading through that, I'm thinking, wait, John, you were in the river baptizing him. You heard the voice from heaven and the dove come like the Holy Spirit. Um that this is my son. And um what from >> also his cousin who like was filled with
00:08:36
the spirit in your mother's womb and leapt with joy. >> Yeah. >> Because of this like the if anybody's going to know it should have been John, >> right? And and yet here he's in prison and and I I don't know. I I guess I read between the lines here. He's here he's in prison. He's is he sends his disciples go see ask this question. So I don't know. Maybe there's doubts. Maybe there's uncertainty. I mean um you know in in what in how John has has lived in
00:09:02
the call being a prophet and making uh uh a way in the wilderness right this is a the the prophecy that was written that he is a part of and living out in the way that he's been living in the life but here he's sitting in prison >> and eventually we'll lose his head he doesn't know that now but we know it in scripture and um and so the the idea that for me that joy joy uh uh our questions, our questioning or sitting in place of uncertainty uh does not crush joy and the joy of the
00:09:37
Lord. It it and I and I was even sensing in this piece of of what Jesus is offering his disciples when he says, "Go back and tell John here's what's taking place." That for me was like, "Oh, John's going to hear Isaiah. John's going to see this. This is the promise of what has been called by the prophets. What you've read and what you have proclaiming been pro proclaiming yourself here it is now taking place through Jesus. >> Yeah. Well, and I think the the
00:10:12
call out in that too is like uh those doubts which maybe is an is a display of like weariness of the heart, right? >> I'm tired. I'm weary. like I'm waiting. I've been waiting. I'm in prison now. Like whatever. Um at least that can be true for us. I know. So in those spaces, joy like that gladness that is um that can also help remind or pull us out of those. And that's the other piece in in Isaiah, right? And even like I didn't talk about this on Sunday, but there's a
00:10:43
kayazm I think in Isaiah 35. when I was reading I was doing some like looking at it but the the front end and the back end and then also throughout this this theme of joy and gladness but also singing and there's like a this is like a >> uh ABC kayazm so it's a little bit harder um but in that the for me what was landing and and again I didn't I don't know I'd have to dig deeper to to know exactly like okay what uh I don't know like if there's mid rush around this or whatever but um
00:11:17
this idea of like joy and gladness and singing and that's Isaiah says with this news so this joy with this gladness with this singing strengthen those who have tired hands that call out of like in the places where I find myself doubting or weary or whatever what do I do in that um and so for me uh even then the the tiein to uh the Luke one story and the the traditional Christmas like we're looking at Mary, we're looking at Elizabeth and Zechariah and like what's taking place there and we see those
00:11:51
things like Mary Mary gets this news of like here's what's going to happen and um on some level there is joy like oh my gosh the Messiah is coming that's such good news and also like certainly Mary this young girl is understanding like this is about to get really hard for me like things are about to about to be pretty difficult um as I'm going to carry this child and I'm not married and you know people are going to think things and and there's uh consequences for that in my culture and you know all
00:12:23
of that >> and and yet her response she goes right into this song of of joy and gladness and like calling out of who God is and um there's something in that that's like yeah how do we respond when life is hard [snorts] when I'm tired? when the doubts are in my mind, um how do I respond? Because my response can actually encourage myself, you know, God God can use the joy, the gladness to encourage my heart. >> Um >> yeah, >> it it also can encourage the people
00:12:59
around you. And so this brings to mind a conversation I even had on Sunday. >> Um and talking with an individual who is navigating difficult season of their life and um the statement they made to me was I have that joy that that inexpressable joy that we read in in First Peter. And um and I turned to them and I said I see it. Let me affirm. I was like, "Let me affirm that I see it." And we both I mean, they're walking through a difficult season. I I um praying with them for them uh desiring
00:13:38
to intercede, but not living >> right. >> I am not living that that trial or that hardship. But but I do see it and recognize and I also in that space was like affirming I see this joy >> this inexpressable joy when in in all for every other way and reason it doesn't make sense that you would have this kind of joy for what you are navigating in your life and yet >> right >> this joy of the Lord is strengthening you in ways that that allows you to show up in spaces
00:14:12
um that without that we're maybe maybe it's a retreating away. Maybe it's a recoiling from even entering into those kinds of spaces and moments. Um and and and it and so it's a it's yes, it strengthens us, but it also testifies and a witness to those around us that um this too can be the joy that wells up in with me like a spring that overflows uh in in the good times and the victories and and we don't often don't take notice as much in those moments that there's joy because every we're
00:14:50
all, you know, when there's victory and moments of success, we're all happy and there's a the feeling emotion, right, of joy or happiness. But in the trial, in the hard when when there isn't a joy that an inexpressable joy that wells up within us even in those trials, that's when it's like, boy, that's noticeable. >> So noticeable. And it's uh and it's encouraging. Um it helps me show up in those spaces, but also encouraging me to see others who walk that out.
00:15:18
>> Right. Yeah. And isn't that what I don't know, isn't that what it looks like to uh live a life that's uh shaped like Jesus and that points people back to him? Because that's the only right like uh I guess that is that not maybe the best um evangelism tool, >> right? >> Like, hey, uh I'm going to show up in a world of brokenness and I'm actually not I'm not uh removed from it. I'm not uh set apart from the now and the hard things in the now. But what I do have is
00:15:54
a hope and a peace and a joy. We'll talk about love this week, but all of these things I do have these things um that actually don't make sense in this. And that's only because of who God is. >> Yeah. Yeah. And and that's where I I sort of towards the end on Sunday and still resonating with me today is that um we can choose joy. You know, joy as a as a choice. We can choose it. God and and and not that I can manufacture it, but I can choose to say my joy isn't founded on the
00:16:27
circumstances around me, but it's in it's in Christ alone. I can choose that and then allow him to renew my spirit and and my strength. Um also, you know, we can have joy as expression of trust. I trust you, Lord. Even in the undone, the uncertain, the anxious, the fearful, I trust you. And that joy uh uh can be that again well up within us that overflows. And then we just as we were talking about joy as witness and then joy is a posture. We can have joy as a posture in which um uh my my my my presence, how I show up in
00:17:08
spaces um can be this even in and especially maybe even so the in the hard spaces, the trials, not this like um you know bent over broken >> but I can okay if the joy of the Lord of my strength. Then there is a posture that that and not even just the physical posture, but the posture in which I I communicate and and engage in relationships, show up in spaces that um things aren't always perfect and I don't want to offer a a fake or a facade. But if the joy of the Lord is my strength, it's founded there, then then
00:17:48
it then I do show up differently and especially in in trying moments and times and spaces. Yeah. Well, but I think that um that comes from that has to come from a closeness with God. And that was the piece because you you said like we can choose joy and that and I know what you mean there. And and yes, um >> but I can't I uh I can't will myself into joy. >> No. >> Outside of the presence of the spirit. So the the choice there actually um >> it's not necess it's not maybe it's not
00:18:32
always specifically I'm choosing joy. It's I'm choosing Jesus and I'm choosing to remain close. And what I know to be true is the byproduct of a closeness with God and an indwelling of the spirit. The byproduct of that is joy and peace and hope and love in these times and spaces because sometimes and and we've talked about this before. I think we even talked about it on here because um uh a pastor friend of ours, Pastor Ryan had talked about hope way back in October and in this same context where
00:18:57
like >> we sometimes we think like okay I have to choose to have hope but hope is not like biblical hope is not something I manufacture correct it's something that comes out of it's an outflowing an outpouring of the spirit >> in the same way that hope and peace is or peace and joy is right this is >> a byproduct of our yeah engaging our presence with Yeah. And that's what I mean is like I actually don't know and and this is semantics and I also know uh because I
00:19:25
know you and I know I know what you mean there, but like there are going to be times where I'm like this is like I I can't choose joy. If I if I'm if I'm trying to choose joy right now, um >> it looks fake. >> What I'm saying is like I'm trying to force myself to be happy and and fake this. >> What I can always do is choose Jesus knowing that that's where the joy is. Yeah. >> Um >> and and so I can lean into that. And that was the thing that stood for me. It
00:19:52
still stands um now. And it it came even you know how this happens but even as I was preaching like this was not in my notes. Um but the I was using as an illustration I was using the story of Corey Tinboom um and and her family. Uh her story is documented in the the book The Hiding Place. Well, other books too, but um and they were a Dutch family who uh uh followers of Jesus who uh hid a bunch of Jewish people, a number of Jewish people in their home uh in early World War II and then ended up in
00:20:29
concentration camps and just like all of the horrific things that we know to be true in that time and space uh her and her sister walked through. Um, and throughout all of it, this just significant um, she would say in her sister, but I think it's true in her too. Um, just this significant like it doesn't make sense the joy and the hope that they were able to hold on to through these circumstances. But what was landing for me uh, even as I was preaching Sunday and and now and even as we're talking is that that came out of a
00:21:02
practice of those things. So the the whole first part of the hiding place book um like the at least half of it is before the start of the war and she's talking about what it looked like to live as a family in this you know in Holland and um their regular literal everyday like clockwork practice of reading scripture together in the morning reading scripture together in the evening and whoever was in the house like this is what we're doing this is what we do in this home. uh daily prayers, this rhythm of like in this
00:21:37
home we start and end our day with Jesus and throughout the day we spend time with Jesus and we do that corporately and collectively regardless of what's happening. Um and then also this practice of like whoever knocks on the door will find an open space here and that we we don't have much we have you know nothing compared to our standards now. um we don't have much and we don't have space, but um you you will find an open >> seat at the table here in this home. And that was just their practice like long
00:22:06
before the war ever started. That's just what existed in their home. And so then when push comes to shove and these horrific things are taking place like there's not a question of like how are we going to respond? This is already baked into the DNA and the culture of this family. So, of course, they're going to uh hide Jews and and keep be a safe place, a refuge for them because that's what they were for sick people and homeless people and uh people in need with with other hurts prior to
00:22:36
that. And then same thing like um when they are in these concentration camps and things are absolutely utterly horrific, they're able to find joy and to call out. I mean, like the the part that I shared, they're literally like, "Thank you, God, for the how these fleas are like fleas are literally biting them. They're covered in fleas and they're praying out first Thessalonians 5 of like we're going to give great uh give thanks in all circumstances." And so, literally like, "Thank you, God, for
00:23:04
the fleas in this place." And then the story is super cool and and whatever. People can read it. But um the only reason I think the reason they're able to do that is because this is that's who they chose to be before the hard things happened. And that's the piece that landed for me is like will I choose to be close to Jesus knowing that's where joy comes from. Will that be the thing I practice? Um because if I can practice joy when things aren't hard, then when the world bumps up against me, um then
00:23:36
I'm I we we've been using this language of like saturation. Am I so saturated in the spirit, so absolutely full of the spirit that when life is hard and the world bumps up against me, it's joy that comes out, it's peace and love that comes out. Um and that's not like >> I don't know. That's not like, gosh, I hope when things get hard, and you know, you're talking about this this person you're having a conversation with, and I I hear that and I'm like, gosh, I hope
00:24:00
that would be true of me. That if I'm navigating a really rough season, I hope what you're saying would also be true of me. >> But if that's like, hey, I hope someday when when I'm going through a rough season that that's true of me. I [clears throat] think I'm I think we're missing it because I think it's like, hey, actually, is that true of me now? Am I practicing these things now? >> Yeah. And that's that's the posture as of a Jesus-shaped church that we that
00:24:24
that we that we lean in uh and and move closer into uh our relationship with Jesus that Jesus would be at the center and we would orbit around him in all aspects of our life, right? and and that the the no matter the season or what's going on in our life the but if in every moment every day that's our our aim that's our focus then that's the posture uh of a Jesus-shaped church that that Jesus would be at the center and and in in all ways uh we would desire to move closer and closer uh so that
00:25:00
>> when we're in these moments of hardship and tragedy what comes out is Jesus what what is what is you know we're so like you said so saturated with him that that's what gets that's what overflows and that that piece was you know what I my sense of or from Sunday was this posture of we can choose joy as a posture that um and and it's a posture of a Jesus-shaped church that that it isn't joy is not my aim my aim is Jesus and the a characteristic that comes out or or an expression of
00:25:34
him is joy in the same way that it is peace, it is hope, um, and it is love, which we'll we'll get into next week. But in these in in these through the season of Advent and in these weeks as we go through these themes of hope, peace, joy and love, these are the things that desire if we are um moving h shaping our life uh after Jesus um and being filled by him that these are the things that would be a byproduct of that. >> Right. So, as we wrap this up, what's the what's the chyros for you? What's the
00:26:14
We've talked I mean, we already talked about like what's still sticking, but um what's God saying right now and and how's he inviting you to respond? Yeah, I guess it's what you just said there um a moment ago of I don't want to be in a place where I in seeing uh those who are struggling around me and that well there's an inexpressable joy within them and the thought of me I hope if I am navigating something like that I too would have that kind of joy but what where am I at
00:26:48
now do do I have that uh joy going now. No matter the circumstances, no matter the hard or the easy or the joyful, doesn't matter. Um, do I have that now? Is it existent in me now? And and do I know it? Am I recognizing um and calling attention to it, calling it out in myself? Um, and am I calling it out in others? Um, in the way that I was able to do that on Sunday. I think there's something beautiful about uh others seeing something in us and calling attention to it like I affirm that in you or I see this in you. And I
00:27:28
think so I think it's both of those pieces is the chyros of of um what does it look like for me now? Uh the this joy in the now and the not yet and um and am I calling attention and calling it out in others that I I see this in you? >> Yeah. Yeah, that's um same similar for me. Um I think that idea of like where am I practicing now? Um where am I practicing not and I uh maybe the the next layer of that for me is not practicing joy and hope and love and peace. Um although those are
00:28:08
not bad things to practice, but um where am I practicing closeness with God? um the presence of God. Uh knowing that those other things will flow out of that, but am I? It's those quiet practices. And we've been talking about this for a number of years now um as we've been intentional about spiritual discipline, but like uh this week was a reminder for me of those quiet practices that create space for me to meet God. And um [clears throat] am I practicing those intentionally knowing like uh I my
00:28:45
greatest desire is closeness with God and out of that those other things like I actually don't have to worry about those uh those things coming if I focus on being close to God. And so, um, the invitation this week of like remain in those quiet practices. Uh, yeah. >> Yep. That's good. Well, we we hope and pray that you two are having [music] conversations that go beyond Sunday that uh God stirring in your heart and soul um uh more of a initi or an invitation to move closer and um see and receive
00:29:23
more of him. And out of [music] that will come joy and peace and hope. Um and so until next week when we're um diving into love, uh [music] have a great week.
